Vanquish - good or not?

[sunburned]

Is the Vanquish a good buy? Ignoring value for money, does it perform well on criteria such as reliability, robustness, mechanical performance (ie. tight tolerances and no marked degradation over time) and technology (ie. does it have the same or better technology than equivalent reels).

I'm looking at buying either a Vanquish, 2015 Twinpower or maybe a Daiwa (but I've never used Daiwa so not quite sure where to start, probably Certate). The Vanquish looks quite nice but I'm wary of buying old technology and there are relatively few reviews about it around.

[bamm]

Man any of the reels u have mentioned are awesome depends what u like but it should a like u don't know what u want and don't get caught up in the new technology sales pitch the company's are brilliant it's a fishing reel not a bionic arm

[Partizan Fk]

Most reels are great and have their uses.Depends what rod your putting it on and what fishing your doing.Dont get caught up in technology.
Daiwa make some great reels as does Shimano.
If you can take your rod in to the store and put it on you can see what it feels like in your hand.
The new Stradic is a nice reel mate im waiting for the 1000 to come out.
Good luck mate.

[Yellafella]

The Vanquish tend to be a lighter reel vs other models on the market. This is the very reason I bought and exsence C3000 as the reel was 195g, had the capacity and drag system of a 3000 and balanced perfectly with the rod I intended to put it on. For the application I put it for (yak fishing snags for a massive array of species) it works perfectly.

As the other have said, looking at the overall composition of the combo(s) you intend to use the reel for will guide you in the ultimate purchase. Start there and the clarity for your decision making will be that much easier.

[sunburned]

Thanks. I've got a stradic fi on a t-curve 706 which I'm happy with and use for 1-5kg, 1-7gm sp, metals, hardbodies and bait. I'm thinking of getting a second outfit for the same purposes (but probably with a rod at 6' or
so for casting at snags) and am tossing up whether to stick with a stradic or get something better. It's really a question whether the Vanquish is a noticeably nicer reel than the models lower in the Shimano range, particularly in comparison to the newer TP and stradic.

[Martin Lo]

I got a VQ C2000HGS LE sitting in CA due here soon. Will let you know when I get it on the water

[lukereneeseth]

that's a tough one because with technology comes price. Noticeably better than say Stradic/Sustain? Yes, by a fair bit in regards to smooth, robust and tight.

Don't even bother with a 1000 or 2000 if you intent to put it on a rod above 100g. They balance well to a 85g rod or 95g rod @ 6ft.

Mg reels with extra bearings do have a better feel. An the bearing in the spool does help with that.

Short answer is yes. But if you throw in value for money. Hands down I would go with the 11 Twinpower.

Note: I have the 2000, 2500 and 4000 in Limited Edition.

Don't worry about "old technology" I've moved away from new local reels and currently run Vanquish, Complex, Cardiff Area, Twinpower Mg, Twinpower SW, etc and all are nicer to fish with and have stayed true to new far more than the local mid to top range Shimano reels (bar stella). They are all Mg (not SW) no X-ship and as smooth and tight as the 10 Stella
9

[Martin Lo]

Originally Posted by lukereneeseth

Don't even bother with a 1000 or 2000 if you intent to put it on a rod above 100g. They balance well to a 85g rod or 95g rod @ 6ft.

I found balance was more inherent to the rod than reel weight, because the reel is so close to the apex a few grams here and there shifts balance but an inch or two at most.



This is a light inshore stick weighing about 120g with a Cardiff 2000 weighing 160 odd.

Mg reels with extra bearings do have a better feel. An the bearing in the spool does help with that.

Short answer is yes. But if you throw in value for money. Hands down I would go with the 11 Twinpower.

Do twinnies '11 have an Al rotor? I liked the look of them

Don't worry about "old technology" I've moved away from new local reels and currently run Vanquish, Complex, Cardiff Area, Twinpower Mg, Twinpower SW, etc and all are nicer to fish with and have stayed true to new far more than the local mid to top range Shimano reels (bar stella). They are all Mg (not SW) no X-ship and as smooth and tight as the 10 Stella

x2...not make it x10, some of my best reels were first built over 10 years ago, a quick drag upgrade and they can keep up with any modern "game changers" out there. Also is it me or do you guys feel that around the years of 2003-2008 JDM were built to a higher standard than they are now?

[thor]

To your last point, it depends on whether JDM actually means made in Japan or some other cheap labor cesspool.

[Martin Lo]

Originally Posted by thor

To your last point, it depends on whether JDM actually means made in Japan or some other cheap labor cesspool.

both. Looking at it in a manufacturing point of view stuff from 2005 required a lot more CNC time than something made in 2015. That seems to apply to both of the big players.

[lukereneeseth]

rod balance does get real tough with such a light reel. Its never really bothered me probably because I've always picked rods that match with respective reels anyway. But when it comes to a reel that weighs 160g it has been a tad difficult an find myself going with a few custom rods; 8 years after saying I would never go custom again.

I put the C2000hgs on my Areal Pro 7'3 an it just felt like a tip heavy rod with no reel at all. I put it on the Dynamic F1 6'3 12lb rod, felt much the same. Put it on the TNSB 2-6lb 7ft an felt like a nice super light combo. Only a few grams between those rods so I can only gather length has a lot to do with it when playing with sub 180g reels. Now going with a custom Nordic Stage 6'6 that will come in around 95g. Applying a little math it should be perfect for the Limited Ed. 2000.

Yes the 11 TP's have Al rotors. These reels are awesome but the 08 TP are just as good also. I think the only difference between the 2 is X-ship. An I think they swapped out a bearing for a bushing in the lower part of the internal.

2003 - 2008? Much higher standard! Times where good back then for the market. We had some bad economy stages, a recession and a crash. I think a lot of big companies had to make changes to survive and rebuild.
Shimano where putting the best of their best into just about every reel for 07, 08, 09. 90% of their reels had Mg bodies, 8+ bearings, made in Japan Ti coated spool lip and line roller. Reels with the Stella 07 body is all I buy now or reels with the 10 Stella body. For good reason.

[Martin Lo]

I have a feeling that the Lim ed C2000HGS is a bit heavier than the standard with zero difference to performance...it was a reel lusted after for quite a while now.

When you're going custom it'll be easy to find the balance regardless of the blanks inherent balance. A couple of grams on the butt or lightening up just the tip and a few bellies on the guide train will get you there. The use of just a few small 4J Torzites for tip and the next 3 guides does wonders,

I should look for the 2011 TP 4000XG... I wonder how it would go up against the certate hyper customs

Originally Posted by lukereneeseth

rod balance does get real tough with such a light reel. Its never really bothered me probably because I've always picked rods that match with respective reels anyway. But when it comes to a reel that weighs 160g it has been a tad difficult an find myself going with a few custom rods; 8 years after saying I would never go custom again.

I put the C2000hgs on my Areal Pro 7'3 an it just felt like a tip heavy rod with no reel at all. I put it on the Dynamic F1 6'3 12lb rod, felt much the same. Put it on the TNSB 2-6lb 7ft an felt like a nice super light combo. Only a few grams between those rods so I can only gather length has a lot to do with it when playing with sub 180g reels. Now going with a custom Nordic Stage 6'6 that will come in around 95g. Applying a little math it should be perfect for the Limited Ed. 2000.

Yes the 11 TP's have Al rotors. These reels are awesome but the 08 TP are just as good also. I think the only difference between the 2 is X-ship. An I think they swapped out a bearing for a bushing in the lower part of the internal.

2003 - 2008? Much higher standard! Times where good back then for the market. We had some bad economy stages, a recession and a crash. I think a lot of big companies had to make changes to survive and rebuild.
Shimano where putting the best of their best into just about every reel for 07, 08, 09. 90% of their reels had Mg bodies, 8+ bearings, made in Japan Ti coated spool lip and line roller. Reels with the Stella 07 body is all I buy now or reels with the 10 Stella body. For good reason.

[thor]

Sorry but need to disagree with your assessment of CNC time. Still plenty of complex geometry parts in 2015 spinning reels. Actually, the cost of CNC time might be lower today due to the economic downturn and the extended recovery.

It's easy to think that older reels represent a higher standard but before that can be taken seriously, those differences need to be identified and then, quantified. Ball bearing counts and certain features fall short of describing a higher standard.

There are some who do not believe that the Stella FI is a major departure for Shimano until they look at the new gear train and the elimination of the anti-reverse selector. A re-design like this was not about cost savings. Some plastic parts and other choices are.

The first generation Vanquish has a composite rotor with their signature magnesium body. This approach might have been about seeing how much weight reduction was possible. The new Twinpowers took the Stella gear train but did not follow with a composite rotor. My hope is that the next generation Vanquish will incorporate the Stella gear train and eliminate the anti-reverse switch.

You may not like or agree with how the companies change designs, materials and features but the standards for today's high end reels are certainly comparable to anything made circa 2005-2010.

[lukereneeseth]

thor - Sorry bud, I should have mentioned. My statements on Shimano 07, 08, 09 reels had no bearing on the 15 reels. Solely because I have not used any as yet. Just in comparison to the Stradics, Sustains, etc (excluding the 10 Stella)

When it comes to bearing count it does represent a level of quality and performance for the Shimano stables. I know there are other brands out there that can have up to 10 bearings and be a $200 reel. But for Shimano bearing count is a progression of quality and price differences. Not saying a Sustain is better than a Stradic because it has more bearings. But bearing placement and amount will always have a strong hold on identifying the Shimano reels, from A-Z.

Agree with everything you have said though. Will be interesting to see if they do make another Vanquish. There's not much room to play with design and technology wise between the 15 Twinpower and Stella FI.

[Martin Lo]

Originally Posted by thor

Sorry but need to disagree with your assessment of CNC time. Still plenty of complex geometry parts in 2015 spinning reels. Actually, the cost of CNC time might be lower today due to the economic downturn and the extended recovery.

It's easy to think that older reels represent a higher standard but before that can be taken seriously, those differences need to be identified and then, quantified. Ball bearing counts and certain features fall short of describing a higher standard.

There are some who do not believe that the Stella FI is a major departure for Shimano until they look at the new gear train and the elimination of the anti-reverse selector. A re-design like this was not about cost savings. Some plastic parts and other choices are.

The first generation Vanquish has a composite rotor with their signature magnesium body. This approach might have been about seeing how much weight reduction was possible. The new Twinpowers took the Stella gear train but did not follow with a composite rotor. My hope is that the next generation Vanquish will incorporate the Stella gear train and eliminate the anti-reverse switch.

You may not like or agree with how the companies change designs, materials and features but the standards for today's high end reels are certainly comparable to anything made circa 2005-2010.

I was thinking of say...a Millionaire needed a whole lot of milling from billet of extruded Al as opposed to an injection molded Zaion frame.