First boat project

Sounds like water in the fuel / carby boowl or no spark to me!.

Lets eliminate the obvious first eh?

With the OB clamped onto say the transom of the boat or a bench in the shed, where you can comfortably work on it....

1. Take the cowl off

2. Remove the sparkplugs

3. Put the spark plug back into the spark plug lead

4. get someone (who doesn't have a dodgey heart or pacemeaker fitted etc) to hold the spark plug body using insulated handle pliers against bare metal somewhere on the engine.

5. Turn out the shed lights at night

6. You pull the outboard start rope a few times like a banshee - it willpull easey because the pulgs are out so there wil be no compression.

7. The holder of the plug lead should see a spark jump across the sparkplug while it's earthed to the engine body.

8. You don't want the fuel line hooked up to do this test - we don't need fuel air vapour comming out the spark plug holes as we are testing for spark...

9. Repeat the terst for both spark plugs.

10. Tell me if you see a small blue spark jumping across the spark plug terminals on both spark plugs.

11. If not, get 2 NEW spark Plugs for your engine and re test as above.

If we don't have spark by now - then you have a potential stator or power pack problem which we can address once we get this far.

Having the lights off in a shed at night time will make the spark easey to see.

Sometimes the plugs get carboned up with burnt 2 stroke oil shorting out the gap on the plugs and this is enough to stop her starting easey. Cleaning them will sometimes fix it - but new plugs always fixes it!

Clean the old ones if they work - and keep them for spares to get you home if one of thenew ones ever fails!

Once we get this out the way, and make sure we have spark - then we can look at fuel.

Ohh - make sure you have the kill/ stop switch set to run when pulling the start cord to check for spark.

Sometimes these kill switches can also short out thru corrosion and stop an otherwise perfect engine from starting and running easey. They have a brass spring pressure plate in them that can get green with corrosion and crud etc - it's not a bad idea to keep them clean & lubed with crc/wd40 to avoid this common trap.

I use a toothbrush and JIF to clean the brass plate in the kill switch along with Boiling water out of a kettle to clean her up shiney.

Let me know if this engine has spark and we'll look at fuel from there.

Cheers!

[Nath_18]

Thanks heaps for that help Trouty.
Ok i have already changed the spark plugs and they are sparking.
You said about the kill switch...could you please xplain this abit more im not so sure on what it is and where to locate it.
Some times i can get the engine to start BUT as soon as you lower the revs or change it into gear (forward) it dies flat!
I might just take it into an OB place and see what they can do.
Thanks again Trouty
SoftBream with the electric bow mount is it foot controlled?
Josh i though about it but it will be a little hard to do two things at once
thanks for the suggestions anyways.

chears, Nathan

[Mim]

Hi Nath,

We used structural ply to do the floors in our boat. Cheaper than marine ply, but basically the same quality, 'cept one side is nopt finished off as nice as in marine ply.

We did not use marine varnish either. The reason we just used standard was that we were told the only difference between marine and standard is that the marine has a UV block in it. We figured that as all exposed ply was gonna be covered with Marine carpet, UV DohDohDohDoh would not be an issue. We have had the floors in our boat for over 12 months and they are just as good as when we first put them in.

If you want to have a look at the thread we did on putting the floors in our boat let me know and I will put the link up for you

Cheers

Mim

re

You said about the kill switch...could you please xplain this abit more im not so sure on what it is and where to locate it.
Some times i can get the engine to start BUT as soon as you lower the revs or change it into gear (forward) it dies flat!

OK Sparks fine - thats good...

Kill switch...

well depending on the age of your outboard you likely have two kill switches.

One is normally in the centre of the front end of the tiller arm and red colored rubber. This one doesn't usually give trouble. The other, is normally on the front of the lower cowl of the engine - if it's a newer model it will be a little red toggle switch that goes either up or down, It is the one where you are SPOSED to fit your lanyard kill switch into then flip up to "run position to hold the lanyard fitting in there. If you are ever thrown from the boat while moving , and have the lanyard attached to your wrist watch strap etc - it's sposed to pull the fitting out of the switch and stop the boat so you can swim to it and get back in.

Lets face ot no one wears them do they?

If your Mercs one of the older variety without the safety lanyard switch - then likely it's a rubber covered switch just to the immediate left of where the fuel line connects.

It's the one your sposed to push to stop your outboard.

Likely thats never been a problem if you can't get it to go eh?


If your OB is actually running (albeit only sometimes) then there is more than likely a fuel supply problem...

BUt - we need to eliminate one more possible electrical issue first.

If as you change the gear lever - or increase the throttle - (you need to do this test without the engine running) look at the components of throttle advance lnkages and make sure they are NOT rubbing up against any of the wires inside the engine cowl.

If for example you had awire rubbed bare and the metal of the throttle linkage components Or the gear change lever - touched the wire - they could be creating a dead short that earths out your electrical power.

Once you are happy that this isn't the case - we need to look at fuel supply.

There will be a small say 1.5 inches x 1.5 inches square plastic fuel pump somehwere on the side of your engine block.

It operates to pump fuel using positive cranckcase pressure,soit has to be on the engine block somewhere...usually uf you follow the rubber fuel line from the carby backwards toward where it eventually comes out to the front fuel hose connector - you'll find a fuel pump somewhere in between.

These sometimes get perforated rubber flap valves in them - you can get a kit to replace the rubber parts and the small gauze filter screen. Often you will find water and grit trapped in here - it can starve your engine of fuel if not clean, and cause the symptoms you describe.

Best buy the kit and replace the rubber parts - it isn;t hard - just pay attenmtion to which way they open and close BEFORE you pull all the rubber valves out...best get the kit - lay rhe pump out on a clean bench surface and put the new rubber components and gauze filter in the way the old ones come out.

Put it back together, then put it back on.

Next - check your ful primer bulb.

Does it work properly - i.e. does it pump up HARD, and fill the carby bowl with fuel when it does get hard?

You can tell this by looking down the throat of the carby, AS you operate the throttle.

When you wrap the throttle on hard and fast - do you see a squirt of fuel shoot out into the carby throat from a small jet hole in the inside of the carby throat?

(Again your doing this with the engine OFF).

This is your high speed acceleration jet.....sometimes the carby pump diafragm goes and this will cause the symptom you describe.

If you get to this point and we have a problem - then probably you shpoould take it into a marine service centre- because rebuilding carbys isn't for the faint of heart...(but with a little knowledge and a workshop manual you could do it!).

Obviously - your low speed idle jet works, since you say sometimes the engine will start and run, but dies when you change gear or accelerate the revs.

I suspect you have water in your fuel that has got to your carby bowland likely taken some small ieces of debris into your mid range jet in your Carby - again probably a job for your marine service centre to fix - bit there is ONE possible home fix you can try if you want first.


If you can get the engine to start and idle, and then to rev high - you can block the carby throat suddenly by placing your palm across it to starve it of air. The suction created is sometimes enough to such thru the carby jets any water or crud that are blocking them.

So how do you get the OB to start and run to high revs if every time you accelerate the throttle it stalls?

Well, you need to supply the fuel - that the carby jets can't, manually.

This is a dangerous practice and needs to be done with some care and common sense.

Obviously - the engine needs to have it's muffs on or leg in a drum of water...since we are going to run her up to high revs and she will need to be cooled with water not to do damage.

Next we need some way of supplying fuel to the carby. This we can do with an empty squeeze trigger spray bottle, like your mum probably uses to spray and wipe down the kitchen benches and dining table etc or wash the windows with.

It needs to be empty and dry inside.

You need to put in only a small amount of fuel, you don't want to go filling it up - you'll only need an egg cup full of fuel...the less the better, for safety reasons.

If you have a face mask of the clear plastic variety used in workkshops for protecting you face from chips and dust etc it's probably not a bad idea to wear it for this test...

Reason is - if anything happens it backfires thru the carby, you don't want a face full of flame, your hair and eyebrows grow back - but ya look funny for a few weeks - and you wouldn;t be the first..

Maybe keep that yella fire extinguisher handy next to where your working too -just before you throw it away....could come in handy yet! (Forget the legalities and environmental implications - it might stop you burning down the garage house boat outboard -= just keep it handy for a sense of security.

What you do - is squirt a small amount of fuel down the throat of the carby until a 'small' moist pool is visible in the bottom of the carby throat, less is better than too much - we don't want to flood the engine neither do we want an ignition like Hiroshima..

Just get her good n wet is all..

Then pull start her and she should start pretty easey with the spark working right and the fuel there.

You SHOULD be able to accelerate her due to the extra fuel we have supplied above and beyind what the idle jet can provide.

if you do get her to rev up - grab the spray bottle and add a cople more squirts down the carby throat while she's revving higher, so that she revs right up - then quickly slap ya palm across the carby throat to starve her of air.

With any luck - the suction created will pull any water from your carby thru the jets and out thru the ebgie exhaust ports and she MAY start working like normal from the throttle alone.

If not gove her another go with the squirt bottle...and palm treatement...

If that don't work - then it's off to the marine mechanic for a carby overhaul.

BUt you never know - you might just get it sorted using that method...

Cheers & good luck - don't go blowin yaself up with that fuel and squeeze bottle...go steady - and keep the source of your fuel - (drum - boat fuel tank, whatever) CLOSED and well away from where your workog - make suer the garage s well ventillated, with the doors wide open etc etc...

A small flame out from a backfire is scary enough, but of the whole shed goes up coz you left the fuel drum open and next to where your working - well thats no fun at all for anyone - you do need to use some common bloody sense when doing this sort of thing...

Obviously - no one smoking would be a good start also!

Best a luck!

(Oh yeah, a squeeze bottle with some fuel in it has got a dead engined boat back to the boat ramp before today - always a handy thing to have aboard a squeeze bottle, just get the fuel from your tank hose when the need arises - no need to keep fuel in the squeeze boittle - only add it IF & when you ever need it!).

[Nath_18]

Trouty thank you SO much for all your help!
How many key boards do you go through in a year from typing so much stuf out to help people?! LoL
Im off now to do everything you just said and ill let you know how i go.
Words can not discribe how helpfull you are Trouty! you little ripper!

chears, Nathan

When i was younger, some kinder folks along lifes way tought me things - and i't fun to pass em along to todays youth - i'd sooner see you guys workin on ya outboard that out getting into strife...

Hey don't dice that DohDohDoh Extinguisher either!

Take iot in to one of the fire places and let them recover the CFC gas - but KEEP the cyclinder!

Once empty - if you drill the right size hole in it up near the neck, you can put a car tubless tyre valve in it. The fill with compressed air from either the garage, or tyourown compressor. Chuck on the boot and if you get a flat tyre or have to let your tyres down, fro soft sand when 4wd or whatever, you have an instant charge of compressed air to re inflate.

They have a round valve thing so you can tell when it's getting full....and if it's still holding a full charge!

If ou ever wanted too - you could fil it with oxygen from a oxy acetylene bottle set, and use the compressed oxy to pump into your boats livewell...

Handy little Pressure Cylinders that size aint easy to come by and can have some neat uses.

An portable air supply for a air stone in a esky full a water if you want to translocarte fish and soon..

A reservoir under your car bonnet that you can connect a rotary vane compressor from an air conditioning unit up to, with an electronic clutch switch to turnon and off - you have ya own tyre inflater compressor built into the vehicle etc etc...

Just a tip!

Cheers!

[Nath_18]

LoL great idea Trouty

I thought i better tell you that the motor is an old Johnson 6hp Seahorse.
I pulled off the filter and checked out the diaframs (mind my spelling) and one of them was looking pretty screwed up at the top so there might be a problem there.
I havnt really had a great look at it yet s ill let you know whats going on.

One last thing to, The carbie looks asthough it has been replaced before (carbie colour deosnt match original green like on the rest of the motor). When i brought the boat of an old guy he had a full service done on it and iv only had the thing out about 5-6 times since! so.....

chears, Nathan

[Stu_000]

Trouty

Top idea for re-using the extinguisher (almost). The problem however, is people are tempted to discharge it to save the trouble of taking (and any cost) to a collection point. And as detailed earlier that's a no-no. I think it is safer to give it away and use another type or something similar. Sh*t its a barrel of laughs setting off an extinguisher is it?

I might be pessimistic but I'm also a realist........................

[Nath_18]

Ahahaha Stue it's more than a barrel of laughs! I let a whole small bottle go in my friends lounge room once (couldnt find anything better to do.....ok i was drinking again) and it filled the whole room ahaha man it was one of the highlights of my life LoL
Small things amuse small minds

chears, Nathan

i gotta say trouty, ur doing a bloody good job helping nath out, there arn't many people in this world that take the time out to help us youngans!!!

[Nath_18]

Here, here!!!
Id say more than a bloody good job Greg!

chears, Nathan

No worries - I thought it was a 10 Merc so there ya go...

As it happens one my second ever OB was a 6 Hp Johnno which almost got me killed one day surfing the hole in the wall break at lancelin in a 12 ft Brooker.....

Th good ol days!

Funniest thing was I had my ol man aboard and he was more scared than me! hehehe...

I still remember the whites of his eyes lookin up at me as the wave crashed thru the boat!

I wrapped a pot rope round the leg while surfing the wave and when it got to the float it jammed and we came to a sudden halt, but the wave kept going - straight thru us!

Anyway the ol Johnno 6 kept going and I got the floatoff and we just got outta there before the next wave woulda finnished us off, bailing like a couple banshees...

Gotta love pullin pots in a tinny!

Now - that 6 HP Johnno is almost unkillable - the carby was alloy unpainted from memory and the blocks a kinda dark green - right?

The Johnno's pretty straight forward, and easey to work on (compared to a Merc)...so you should be able to get it going.

Those old ones do have a set of points under the flywheel from memory.

OK...Fuel - so any report on what state you have?

The fuel pumps got a bad rubber flap valve eh?

You'll need a new set, water in the fuel - gets trapped against the gauze filter in the pump and stays there - perishing the rubber in the pump.

Fix that and see if you can get her to run.

I doubt that alone will fix it - but it might...

If the carbys got water / crud in it - then - you'll need to drop the bowl - I think it's only got 2 or 3 screws hold it on.

Just get a stubby screw driver, and drop the fuel bowl from the carby - clean it out with raw fuel, and put it back.

Don't get tempted to blow the carb with compressed air...bit of a no no. It can create a low pressure area in the carby bowl and collapse the fuel bowl foat which will then sink instead of float maning the needle and seat wont shut off and the engine will always flood.

It's OK if you remove the whole carby - and remove the jets with a screw driver, THEN you can blow them out with compressed air before re instaling them.

Make sure if you remove the idle and or mixture screws, that FIRST before you adjust it - to wind it in tight counting the EXACT number of turns. When you re install it - you can wind it in tight then back it out the exact number of turns, and it will be right where it was set before.

You have to be carefull dismantling the carby, not to break the gaskets. If necessary - you can trace and cut new gaskets with a scalpel and some gasket sheet.

It's not rocket science.

You can get parts for old Johnstons online, as well as a workshop manual (Google search).

They aren't that complex - do you good to get familiar with how they work!.

Keep me posted with progress.

Cheers!

[BoofHed]

nath- Make sure u change the fuel cause old fuel goes off.
Trouty has given you all the rite ideas and as he said you should be able to get it goin by the sound of things there not to much rong with it and good luck
Bruce

Old fuel does go stale.....and lose it's octane rating.
Soo - fresh fuel is the go.

While your there - empty the tank out into something like a bucket or large glass coffee jar, where you can see if theres any water in the bottom....

Good chance if your going to fix it - to make sure the same problem isn't lurking inside your fuel tank, ready to mess it up again.

Cheers!

[peter bear]

nath the ply you want is called 12mm CD structual ply ,the only difference between that and marine is the quality of the veneer .

they both use the same glue which is water proof dont bother to coat with any thing under the carpet as the ply will get wet from the sea it will also dry out too.

peter.