The MuddleDuck

[Mim]

Hi All,

Just thought I would let you see what can be done with a Savage Snipe. This pic is how we started

[Mim]

Next came the floor

[Mim]

To keep it strong JP reinforced underneath in line with the struts that run across the boat

[Mim]

The live wells and middle seat

[Mim]

These fit inside the seat to keep the breams alive

[Mim]

Next came the seat at the front of the boat, so that even Mim can use the electric motor. This was the hardest thing to acomplish, as it needed to be strong enough to support the seat with a person sitting on it. Lots of reinforcing was needed, but we were still able to create storage space either side of the seat mount

[Mim]

The storage space

[Mim]

So now it is finished. Just needs a coat of paint to make the MuddleDuck look beautiful

[Mim]

And an inside view

[Mim]

Hope all you guys like what we did. JP is more than happy to share what he has learnt.
Hey I think he should go into business fitting out hulls. All orders gratefully accepted :)

Thanks to Chris Lemes for allowing JP to check out his floor. All this has grown from that visit.


I forgot to add this pic of the stern casting platform, this was done just before the front seat platform

[Davo]

Well done mimbo and J.P.!!!
The finished product looks like a complete different boat to the original pic.
very impressive!!!

I like the idea of the seat with the livewells in it.
great work!!!

Cheers,
Dave

[kevvy]

hi mim,
what a fantastic job youv'e done on your boat, it looks great.
It's given me insperation to try to do something similar now i can see i wouldnt need to spend mega bucks to equip myself with a boat.
Once again congratulations top job.

cheers kevvy.

[Dave W]

That is incredibly similar to how my boat came up after all the work - good onya guys, I'll put some pics up of my floor layout soon:)

[madsurfe]

sounds good Dave, can't wait for a gander at your work.... a lot of work on my end with Mims help. Glad that 95% of it is done.

[AtomicGrant]

Boats looking good JP & Mim but think I better go out in it again (for research reasons :) ) Did you use marine ply? because it is very expensive. At work we sell aquatite flooring which is waterprooof and is only $60 for a 3600 x 900 (but i would get it for 40 odd) Might give it a go in my mates boat

Grant

[madsurfe]

for those that are interested the ingredient list for the structural work on Muddleduck is:

3 - 2400 x 1200 CD12 Structural Plywood
2.5 litres of Gloss Estapol

no need for marine ply or marine varnish as the work is not exposed to sunlight

Carpet and super messy 4lt can of anchorweld

Anchorweld is waterproof and is used to glue Astroturf

100 8g x 1 1/2 inch stainless screws and a dozen stainless bolts...oh 6 stainless hinges

the Livewells are 2 52 litre tubs as opposed to 1 100 litre job which I fiberglassed as per Craigs story in Fishing WA

the seat is totally a personal choice but ours is fully height adj, folding and swivels' to allow for both me and Mim. Yesterday I had to boot her out of the seat to get a drive. Various bits and pieces like wiring and fuses , bilge pump etc

[pw-bream]

Great work on the boat :-)

Just a note on the varnish, marine and "spar" varnish are usually
long oil varnishes, they stay more flexible when dry than regular varnishes, that is to allow for movement and flexing in wooden boats, it isn't just about UV resistance.

[Mim]

Just a note on the varnish, marine and "spar" varnish are usually long oil varnishes, they stay more flexible when dry than regular varnishes, that is to allow for movement and flexing in wooden boats, it isn't just about UV resistance

This may be true, but the wooden floors, etc in our boat do not flex and move as they would in a wooden boat, and by adding the anchorweld glue, which is waterproof, it will compensate for any slight flexing that there may be.

According to the specialists in the shop where we bought the varnish, the only difference between marine varnish and estapol gloss is that the estapol does not block UV DohDohDohDoh. Maybe he was wrong, but we will be happy to get 3-5 years out of the floor, as we are hoping to have a better hull by then and start all over again

Cheers,
Mim

[jonesy2]

Mim & JP
Great Looking Boat !
just a note on the floor setup in your snipe.
because of the downward load and the floor is supported by the hull , I have seen some small tinnes split along the hull join.
what can be done is to weld in a brace between the tops of the hull ribs then screw the floor to the brace.

the tinnies I have seen split have been in the Nwest of wa and are used offshore and up the creeks, so they get a bit more of a pounding. But with everyone setting up Bream boats with Live tanks ,elect motors , large batteries etc ther is a lot of weight added to the boat. it is something you may want to have a think aboutanyway

I have a 4.2 Savage Kestral that I have fitted a full floor to etc.
I dont have access to a digital camera but if you guys are in perth ( I'am south of the River ) you are more than welcome to come around home and I will show you what I mean.

[Mim]

if you guys are in perth ( I'am south of the River ) you are more than welcome to come around home and I will show you what I mean.

Hi Jonsey,

Yep we are in Perth. North of the river in Kingsley. Maybe we could meet down at the Coode St launching ramp one day and have a look. It would be great.

JP has reinforced the floor underneath, but would be interesting to see what you have done.

With the new 30hp motor the boat flew down in Walpole. Getting up on the plane was too easy, and the boat performed brilliantly. Hardly a splash.

We will have to work out a good time to catch up

Cheers,

Mim

[jonesy2]

With the new 30hp motor the boat flew
I can relate to that , I have 40 hp on the back.

The boat is parked up for the next couple of weeks due to other commitments, but South Perth sounds like a good idea.
Im interested in seeing how you guys setup your front seat



thanks

[Mim]

We are probably going out Thurs or Fri this week as JP has to work all weekend :(

If you are free let us know and you can maybe hitch a ride on our boat :)

JP is always looking for someone to fish with, cos I get stuck infront of the puter doing stuff for uni

Just let us know

Mim

[madsurfe]

We have had some enquiries for more detail about the build on the Muddleduck, so here I go:

In the first pic you can see the ribs in the dinghy well the floating floor has 3 horizontal beams that sit inside the V of those ribs.

You can see in the 3rd pic that the end of each horizontal beam has been cut to match at an angle to match the rib. I have since used some carpet on the end of each to minimise rubbing on the ribs. The floor also sits on the flat area at the end of each rib which you can see in the 3rd pic as the pieces of orange neoprene, again to minimise rubbing.

You need to work with the structure of the hull. Now to prevent wear the outside of the floor edge is bevelled so that it doesn't touch the gunwales or any area other than the ribs. Weight is distributed evenly. To and fro movement is prevented by an extension to the front of the floor that bolts to the front thawrt seat with the addition of aluminium right angle brackets. The livewell/seat locates on the rails for the removable middle thawrt seat. It does not move and helps to stabilise the floor.

The rear deck is 2 pieces of ply cut to shape being supported by the rear thawrt seat and right angle aluminium riveted to the transom. I added a horizontal beam under each for torsional strength and it also helps to lock it all in to prevent twisting. The two pieces are held in place by 3 shock cord loops. This also stops them flying out when being towed.

The brackets can be seen in the first pic as they are padded with blue neoprene. The brackets are riveted to the seat. The support is screwed to the floor and pic nine shows it all bolted together.

It was time consuming and very fiddly, you need to measure 6 times and cut once. Every boat will be different. Savage also received pics of the boat and strengthened areas so that we could insure the hull and run a 30hp 2 stroke Yamaha as the four stroke motors are too heavy for the transom.

I hope this helps as it is not easy to explain.

[wingala]

This is one of the many in my fleet. My policy is keep costs to a minimum and never invest more than $100 per vessel. They are then tied up in one of the many bays around Sydney harbour. Depending on what bay I/we wish to fish, there is a luxury launch at our disposal. I've got 6 in total and a new one is on the way. This one lives in Sailors Bay. which has around 5 acres of pontoons excellent drop offs and a couple of tidal flats. It takes 5 minutes to be in the water and 5 hours to complete a circuit of the bay. I got the rudder idea from Don and a mate from NASA helped me refine the gem. My finder clamps on to the transom and the console lives in a lunchbox.
The motto is u can't have enough G clamps

[wingala]

It's all class!

[Fishtale]

Great Job with the snipe!

Wanna do mine?

:) :)

[Mim]

We have had a few people ask us what the costs involved were. I thought we had them saved somewhere, but, sorry we don't.

We didn't do this all at once and bought bits and pieces here and there as we decided to do something else, so to tell you the breakdown at this stage would be virtually impossible. Look out for things to go on special and always try to barter on prices.

Wanna do mine? We can do anything at a price, :D , but if you are serious, we could try to work something out.

Cheers

Mim

[i_wanna_fish]

thans guys:cool: :)

[panger]

Wingala,
what kind of boat is that? Doesn't look like a normal tinny. Is it one of those fibreglass boats people row to get out to their expensive yachts.

[madsurfe]

OK Guys I found an old text file with some details, it'll at least be helpful for WA breamers as to vendors:

It also pays to take your time and try things out before finally fitting. Keep in mind weight distribution. Our boat has even distribution and it shows in it's performance i.e. it planes real easy and does 28 knots.

Now to answer some questions:

use CD12 Ply. It generally comes in sheets 2400x1200x12 i.e. it is 12mm thick and the same glueing construction as marine ply. It is half the price at $45 or thereabouts a sheet because it doesn't have the fine exterior finish of marine ply, but hey that doesn't matter cos' it's covered by carpet. I gave all the timber work 3 coats of Wattyl Estapol Gloss before glueing or carpeting. The work is now 18 months old and the timber is fine, unaffected by water.

You can get the ply from a timber vendor down your way thats if your still at South Lake

I think I got my 1st sheet from

Morgan Timber
41 Miguel Rd Bibra Lake WA 6163
ph: 1800 683 733 Plywoods & Veneers

as we had been down at Freo with the boat

I got the rest from

M & B Sales
144 Beechboro Rd Bayswater WA 6053
ph: (08) 9272 2555 Plywoods & Veneers

just around the corner from M & B is

BOAG Distributors
3a Chalkley Place
Bayswater WA 6053
ph: (08) 9272 5566

this is where I got the carpet and adhesive. The important thing here is that they have rolls of boat carpet that is 4 m,etres wide. So I bought 1.5 x 4m for $72 and 4 litres of adhesive for $29.50

The livewells were a pain as I bought 2, 52 litre styrofoam boxes from

Foam Sales.
Quality, Integrity, Service & Price.
82 Norma Rd Booragoon WA 6154
ph: (08) 9330 1199

at about $12 a pop or you can buy just one large one. Now I have some experience with fibreglass and expoxy and thus bought the epoxy resin and cloth to cover the boxes. It cost $125 for the bits and pieces to do the job and there was no room for error. You have to use epoxy with styrofoam as you will melt the foam with polyester resin.

I now think it would be better to try adapting a couple of eskies. A lot less bother than mucking around with epoxy. Quite a few breamers have adapted eskies that cost all up about $90 because they were bought when on sale. You also need to factor in plumbing costs for hose, fittings and bilge pump/s. You can spend $200 very easily for plumbling with a thru transom pump.

We also spent $300 on welding. Rails were added, the ribs relaid and strengthened, as was the transom to take some extra weight of a larger motor. The welding was done by a guy just up the road from Access Boating on the left hand side of Buckingham Drive Wangara.

I got all my bits from Access Boating at Wangara cos' there 5mins from where I live and I also did work for them. Rod and Rhyss are very helpful.

Now the paint job cost around $350. It is 2pack in Opel Aquamarina and was sprayed by myself in a booth and I wore full coveralls, gloves and resperator. Do not muck around with 2pack as the vapour contains cyanide. Upon reflection I could have got the guy that worked at the paint supply to paint the boat for $150 but I still would have to do the preparation. As usual I like a good job so I did it myself.

[wingala]

Spot on panger, I found this wee treasure on someones rubbish heap at last years council cleanup. You can also get them at govenment auctions. During bad weather and king tides many of the harbourside dingys manage to throw their tethers and make a bid for freedom. Waterways authority pick them up and hold them for six months. If there's no identification (most of them are blank) and it's deemed seaworthy they auction them. You can grab them usually between $50 and $100. They are twice as stable as canoes and are unsinkable. We paint all of them purple as our signature range. I get a real kick out of hauling in a monster fish in front of the showpony boats you see around town

[panger]

Wingala,
now you got me interested.

Are they stable enough for 2 people to fish from standing up? Are the light enough for 2 guys to easily mount on to a roof rack?
Are they thin enough to fit onto the roof rack of a smaller car (Pulsar)?

[madsurfe]

Hi Wingala

hey i'd love to get my hands on a couple of those tenders to do up for the leccy events. I reckon there'd be ace. I don't like my chances of finding a couple over here as the tenders over here get it a lot easier weatherwise on the swan. All the mooring areas are pretty well protected.

[wingala]

This one's worth checking out. I put a mariner 4hp and g clamp a converted transom mount 40lb on the bow. It's remarkably stable and comfy for two
http://home.iprimus.com.au/lamoore/framenewdinghies.html

Lamoore Tri Hull 9'6"
Spacious 3 seater, very stable, smooth riding. Forward rear seat allows larger motors. Great fishing boat.
Length: 2.85m
Beam: 1.22m
Weight: 41kg
Sale Price: $799.00

[wingala]

Here's mine after the signature paint job

[wingala]

The 8 footer gets a wee bit tight. However it's small enough to get between the pylons under the docks in Sydney harbour. You have to watch out for the tug boats as they make an enormous wake.


This price is for brand new.
I suggest an extra laminate of fibreglass and glue some steel strips on any area that will run against the ground

Lamoore 8' Tri Hull
Maximum Capacity 8' dinghy. Tri hull for stability. Fits on roof racks. Reinforced bottom, sides, transom.
Length: 2.44m
Beam: 1.22m
Weight: 32kg
Sale Price: $629.00

[wingala]

Here we are in a 9 footer. You have to be prepared to swim if push comes to shove

[i_wanna_fish]

that last pic of the 8' is a bit to low in the water for my liking ;) why doesnt someone buy a 6 footer, stick a leccy on it and make it plane:p

[wingala]

Hey Panger check your PM box.

[panger]

Wingala thanks mate!

[Bream Addict]

hey wingala im intersteed now as well they look great, i reckon i might pick up a 9 footer get a smal leccy for the front and chuck a four hp on the back.
Id be mainly using mine around the docks of melb and up the yarra a bit,does the purple 1 in the pick a have a four, if so does it plane when u fish 1 up?
Does the tri-hull design ride well in a bit of chop?
p.s can u post a few more pics? Thanks.

[wingala]

As Harry Callaghan say's. "A man's gotta know his limitations!"
These little tubs are certainly not designed for planing and I wouldn't attempt it as it would flip.
They are literally tender boats. "tender" in all meanings of the word. You need to reinforce the transom and most definately the bow. I use a couple of g clamps with 2 long bits of ply for the bow and it works fine. You just gotta remember that they are designed for light work.
As I said earlier we have taken the 8 footer in some pretty freaky tug boat swell, saying that, I used to race sailing dinghies and know how to approach swell.
If you don't know then don't do it. Use them where you would use a canoe and you'll be fine. If you're going to have a 4hp and leccy, just use the 4hp to commute to your spot then use your leccy. They ain't high performance boats

[pappy]

Hehe nice boat like the get prepared to swim part but whats funny is you were brave enough to go out on it lol

It looks quite rough!!

cheers pappy